Comments on: A Few Good Men.

A Few Good Men.

Effigy2000 — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 15:59:55 -0800

Guantanamo trials are rigged. So claims the Australian ABC (the Aussie version of the BBC) on its webpage this morning, basing its story on two e-mails leaked to it which express the concerns of two U.S. military lawyers who were involved in the preparations for these trials. While this revelation should worry anyone who believes in a concept of justice, the presumption of innocence and of course, the rule of law, this is of particular interest to Australians, given that our own David Hicks is due to face one of these 'commissions' within weeks.

By: Clay201

Clay201 — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 16:15:25 -0800

Hang on. You're saying that military tribunals orchestrated by Bush's administration, conducted in secrecy, used as a weapon against their adversaries/scapegoats, and not subject to any sort of checks or balances, congressional oversight, or regulation... are rigged?? Imagine my shock.

By: clevershark

clevershark — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 16:15:57 -0800

Guantanamo trials are a lot like voting -- if they could actually change anything there's no way they'd ever take place.

By: Rothko

Rothko — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 16:17:56 -0800

To paraphrase Rumsfeld, you go to war with the rigged tribunals you have.

By: kaemaril

kaemaril — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 16:35:55 -0800

"There is absolutely no evidence that it is rigged." (said Brig Gen Hemingway, as he finished shoving a large wad of papers through the industrial-strength shredder in his office ...)

By: forforf

forforf — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 16:36:18 -0800

Note who the people are that are complaining about the process being rigged. It's the Military prosecutors. The military defense lawyers have already been very local in their condemnation of the process. It's very interesting and telling that some prosecutors feel the same way.

By: grouse

grouse — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 16:38:22 -0800

Wow, they put their concerns in writing? So much for their careers. Good thing there are still people with consciences and principles.

By: all-seeing eye dog

all-seeing eye dog — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 16:42:54 -0800

Good thing there are still people with consciences and principles. well said! too bad more of them aren't in positions of political power, eh?

By: all-seeing eye dog

all-seeing eye dog — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 16:51:55 -0800

it'll be interesting to see what the broader fallout from this story will be on the international scene.

By: delmoi

delmoi — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 17:06:35 -0800

Why is a white australian in gitmo?

By: InnocentBystander

InnocentBystander — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 17:10:30 -0800

Hey, the Supreme Court only said they should get a hearing. They didn't specify a FAIR one. Those lousy terrorists should be happy we're reviewing their cases at all. If we weren't so concerned with freedom, we wouldn't have locked them up in the first place. They'd just be dead. Ingrates. /yes that was sarcasm.

By: hattifattener

hattifattener — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 17:16:03 -0800

It's hard for me to evaluate this, since of course it's exactly what I expect to hear. Hasn't Rumsfeld previously opposed having trials for Guantánamo prisoners, on the grounds that some of them might be found innocent?

By: Effigy2000

Effigy2000 — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 17:29:08 -0800

Why is a white australian in gitmo? delmoi: The first link in this previous metafilter thread about David Hicks should fill you in on that.

By: mosch

mosch — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 18:23:30 -0800

The identity of the complainants reinforces my belief that the military is filled with good, honest people who are loyal to the nation. It's a shame that the guys at the top lack these same ethical standards.

By: Ethereal Bligh

Ethereal Bligh — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 18:46:12 -0800

It's the Pentagon's civil leadership which is evil. And much of the Armed Forces knows it.

By: deanc

deanc — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 19:11:36 -0800

I'm sure that Rumsfeld has heard their concerns and that if you ask any of these nay-sayers in the military about this 10 years from now, they'll quickly tell you something like, "The Guantanamo Tribunals are the fairest, smartest, most open, most well supervised trials I've ever known in my life."

By: all-seeing eye dog

all-seeing eye dog — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 19:27:17 -0800

you forgot the sarcasm tag, deanc.

By: Dunvegan

Dunvegan — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 19:36:28 -0800

Can talk turn the tide? No Nuremberg Trials after, If we whistle blow now?

By: wakko

wakko — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 19:50:14 -0800

The identity of the complainants reinforces my belief that the military is filled with good, honest people who are loyal to the nation. I can't wait to see how the Bush administration "rewards" them.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:32:09 -0800

without even bothering to check first, i can quite safely bet that cruddock, downie & coward are already (still) gushing that they have "the utmost confidence in the amerikan tribunals" etc...

By: buddha9090

buddha9090 — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 21:08:36 -0800

This is, of course, and quite sadly, no surprise. What has surprised me is that while the Administration has gone forward with these sham tribunals, they've actually given some of the detainees excellent attorneys to serve in their defense. I had the opportunity to briefly work with Air Force Lt. Col. Sharon Shaffer, who is representing Ibrahim Ahmed Mahmoud al Qosi, and she was absolutely incredible. Then again, the quality of defense matters little if the judges have no meaningful independence from their boss, Rumsfeld. Same thing if the same defense counsel are barred from going to Guantanamo to actually represent their clients.

By: fullysic

fullysic — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 21:52:26 -0800

without even bothering to check first, i can quite safely bet that cruddock, downie & coward are already (still) gushing that they have "the utmost confidence in the amerikan tribunals" etc... Please allow me to attempt to explain UbuRoivas' comments: Cruddock:Phillip Ruddock AKA 'The Cadaver' - The Simpsons' Mr Burns, only nastier, and more incompetant... Downie: Alexander Downer AKA 'Lord Downer of Baghdad' - Please disregard any sound bites; despite allegedly being Strayan, attempts to pwonounce wowds in the best Qween's Engwish - absolute goose/pork chop. Coward: Where to begin...The Prime Miniature of Straya, AKA 'The Rodent' - Lying when lips are moving...largest sycophant of our era. You (Republican) Amerikains should be so proud so have so great a lapdog in your pocket. For those who are interested in Strayan Meedya that's not Murdoch controlled may I suggest: Despite the Rodent's best efforts, the aforementioned: - Australian Broadcasting Corporation - The Sydney Morning Herald - and,*sniff*, where I first discovered Metafilter (all those years ago...before I could purchase membership): www.crikey.com.au

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 23:08:47 -0800

fullysic: yeh, that comment was aimed squarely at a domestic audience. i should have explained better. two more comments on john-hunt-the-coward: 1. strayan political cartoon of the year, 2003: national brown nose day 2. shrub's recent visit to iraq, in "mission accomplished" style military gear...a letter writer at the SMH quipped: "we have a new action hero: GI Joke"

By: thedevildancedlightly

thedevildancedlightly — Sun, 31 Jul 2005 23:08:51 -0800

Wait, where are the 20+ "GYOBFW" comments on this thread?

By: Jimbob

Jimbob — Mon, 01 Aug 2005 01:30:45 -0800

Oh they aren't here, TDDL, because we're all a bunch of lib'ruls and stuff.

By: flabdablet

flabdablet — Mon, 01 Aug 2005 02:42:00 -0800

Ubu, did the SMH carry the nice letter that turned up in The Age the other day, pointing out the incredible bravery (or perhaps the unintentional on-cameraness) of the guy in a normal business suit leading our distinguished party of flak-jacketed fsckwits through whichever terrorizing hail of bullets they'd decided to get filmed in?

By: flabdablet

flabdablet — Mon, 01 Aug 2005 02:48:38 -0800

fullysic: I'd never really thought of Ruddock as Burns; I reckon he's a dead ringer for Davros.

By: fullysic

fullysic — Mon, 01 Aug 2005 04:15:27 -0800

flabdablet: For me, the recently retired Premier of New South Wales, Bob Carr, will always be Davros.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Mon, 01 Aug 2005 05:54:26 -0800

flabdablet: i saw that letter, forget if it was the age or the smh. age letter eds are kinda stolid, for me. used to frequent age "your say", as 'ali' - eds there so much better than their smh counterparts - but not for a while now.

By: deanc

deanc — Mon, 01 Aug 2005 07:30:51 -0800

you forgot the sarcasm tag, deanc. Maybe I flubbed that my attempt at being humorous, or maybe I so butchered the quote into unrecognizability and the reference was lost.

By: all-seeing eye dog

all-seeing eye dog — Mon, 01 Aug 2005 07:46:43 -0800

ah--didn't catch the allusion. now i see.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Mon, 01 Aug 2005 15:55:34 -0800

deanc: I still don't understand your point about Rumsfeld. Donald Rumsfeld is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life.