Sarah Palin as McCain's running-mate August 29, 2008 7:52 AM Subscribe
Fox, the BBC and CNN have all revealed that Republican US presidential candidate John McCain has picked Alaskan Governor Sarah Palin as his running mate on his 72nd birthday on the eve of the start of Republican National Convention. Despite being wildly popular in Alaska, Palin has recently been involved in an investigation over whether she dismissed a public safety commissioner because he refused to dismiss her former brother-in-law.
posted by HaloMan (5555 comments total)
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In 2005, before Palin ran for office, the Palin family accused [ex-brother-in-law]Wooten of drinking a beer while in his patrol car, illegal hunting and firing a Taser at his 11-year-old stepson. The Palins also claimed Wooten threatened to kill Sarah Palin's father.
You beat me to the punch, though this FPP is better than mine would've been! Never heard of this woman, but it's a smart strategy if only to attract those couple-of-million or so PUMAs, the Clintonites who won't vote for Obama. (Not to be confused with cougars, btw). posted by zardoz at 7:59 AM on August 29
Oooww, this is gonna be fun to watch at Alegre's Corner.
(Alegre being a Hillary dead-ender whose fervent support of Hillary has been eclipsed by her hate for Obama, ostensibly out of love for Hillary.) posted by orthogonality at 8:00 AM on August 29
All snark aside: History is now guaranteed to be made in November. (Perhaps a silver lining in one case, though.) posted by DU at 8:00 AM on August 29 [9 favorites]
McCain wants to siphon the disgruntled/woman scorned Hillary vote, I guess.
Obama's speech last night was incredibly moving. America, such an amazing, wonderful place, would do well to elect Obama. He is the dream realized. posted by plexi at 8:01 AM on August 29 [21 favorites]
It'll be interesting to see how successful the strategy of trying to siphon off -- or at least create some cognitive dissonance in -- disappointed Hillary supporters will be. My guess is that even the most bitter Hillary supporters won't pull the lever for someone as pro-life as Palin apparently is. posted by pardonyou? at 8:02 AM on August 29
Hah! I can't wait until the former Hillary supporters decide that having two X chromosomes is more important than any conceivable position on the issues. Four more years! 100 more years of war! Woohoo! posted by nasreddin at 8:03 AM on August 29 [20 favorites]
She admits that she used marijuana when it was legal in Alaska, but says that she did not like it. posted by R. Mutt at 8:03 AM on August 29
In a near 50/50 split, all the Republicans would need is a small number of Hillary supporters who cared more about what Hillary represented than her policies to switch over. The man is crazy like a fox. posted by the jam at 8:04 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
She was a heartbeat away from being Miss Alaska. posted by Poolio at 8:06 AM on August 29 [13 favorites]
First black president or first female vice president? That's awesome.
My two cents, since that's what this thread is I guess: in comparison to Biden, who seems to have been picked for his expertise and experience, Palin seems like the ultimate ploy to hack the vote demographically - women, younger voters, the base - that seems really off to me. Shouldn't we be thinking now more than ever about who is ready to lead this country on day one, not who can get elected? It all just looks like such a nakedly political move to me in a way that Biden's selection really didn't come off as.
Then again, I'm just another rabid Obama fan in our little echo chamber here, so I don't think the campaign cares what I think posted by Muffpub at 8:06 AM on August 29 [6 favorites]
All the presidents and VPs in US history have been white and male. That is guaranteed to change this January, barring some freak occurrence, and I think that's awesome.
But is the Christian right really going to accept a mother with a 5-month-old infant going on the campaign trail? I've known too many who think that mothers shouldn't be working at all, or at least not till the kids are in school. And there's no way she's prepard to take over if McCain dies. posted by Jeanne at 8:07 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
She was crowned Miss Wasilla in 1984 and was a runner-up in the Miss Alaska pageant. posted by ColdChef at 8:07 AM on August 29
What's the over/under on how long it takes McCain to flip-flop on his position on drilling in ANWAR? He currently claims to be opposed. She is for. Hmmm... who do you think will win? Not the oil companies, surely? posted by The Bellman at 8:07 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
Sarah and Todd Palin have five children: boys Track, 19, and Trig, 4 months, and daughters Bristol, 17, Willow, 13, and Piper, 7.
Dear GOD! Vice Presidents don't get to NAME anything, do they?! posted by ColdChef at 8:09 AM on August 29 [199 favorites]
So Hillary was cheering for Obama to lose so she can have her run in 2012. Now what? If Obama loses, You have McCain for 4-8 years, then you have to run against Palin, another woman and the sitting Vice President. Not only does this cinch the election for McCain, it completely screws over and buries Clinton. Her dream of being the first female President just got a lot harder. posted by loquax at 8:10 AM on August 29 [4 favorites]
Oh my god, really?
Really?
Look, to be fair, I was halfway through a post last night on my own site about how ridiculous I though all the hard-right Freepers/Cornerites/etc. were harping about Palin. She was basically their new Fred Thompson. But I am seriously dumbfounded that they would have been this stupid.
Don’t get me wrong, on a PR level this is masterful for McCain. He’s killed all the momentum and press coverage about Obama’s amazing speech last night. So I really am amazed they think that one shot at gaining the press advantage was worth the most unbelievably inept VP pick I could have possibly imagined.
Forget even among fields of conservatives in general: is anyone from the McCain camp going to make a convincing case that Palin is remotely close to the most qualified woman in the GOP to be a heartbeat away from taking over a guy who turns 72 today and has a history of cancer? She has been governor- for 18 months- of a state with a population smaller than Obama’s state senate district in Illinois. Her previous office was the mayor of an Alaskan town with a population smaller than 3,000 people. At the very minimum, Obama has sat in on foreign policy sessions and dealt with national and international issues on the floor of the U.S. Senate. Palin has no foreign policy experience. This is literally one step above giving the slot to the winner of a game show.
So in what I can only perceive as a complete fit of insanity, McCain has decided to destroy with one pick the three talking points he had as an advantage over Obama:
Experience: She has none. Palin is utterly unqualified to be president of the U.S. Senate, let alone the country should anything befall McCain.
Celebrity: She’s a former beauty pageant winner who’s done multiple cover shoots for fashion and culture magazines and her claim to fame is being the subject of an article titled “America’s Hottest Governor.” There will be more talk about how she’s attractive than her actual policy credentials. Her gender, in light of her utter political weakness, will be seen blatantly- and rightly- as the novelty McCain picked it for. There is no clearer a celebrity pick for McCain than this one.
Moderate Female Voters: Putting aside for a moment that she's outrageously anti-choice, if McCain truly believes that what really appeals to middle-age working-class white women is a younger, prettier, but amazingly less-qualified woman getting the promotion that Hillary Clinton didn’t, then I can’t really reflect any greater how utterly deaf to the interests of women the Republican Party is.
Jesus tap-dancing Christ. If McCain wanted a former beauty queen with no experience and a criminal investigation on her record I don’t know why he didn’t just pick his own wife. posted by XQUZYPHYR at 8:10 AM on August 29 [445 favorites]
Very smart choice by McCain. I mean, sure, nobody knows anything about her, but she covers his biggest flaws: too old, and more of the same. Honestly, is there anyone else he could have picked that anyone would be excited about at all?
(Although, the talking heads are going to have a field day with the beauty queen angle.) posted by designbot at 8:10 AM on August 29
I have this dreadful feeling that America *will* vote for four eight years more of McBush. Obama seems a bit too good to be true, and a adding a somewhat 'progressive' (if an anti-abortion, life-time member of NRA can be called that) swing to his campaign... my somewhat bitter money is on McCain winning this thing.
Also, she (hopefully unfairly) reminds me of Mrs. Kitty Farmer from Donnie Darko. posted by Harry at 8:10 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
Twenty bucks says Lorne Michaels gets Tina Fey to play her on SNL. It's uncanny! posted by ColdChef at 8:11 AM on August 29 [13 favorites]
Hah! I can't wait until the former Hillary supporters decide that having two X chromosomes is more important than any conceivable position on the issues. Four more years! 100 more years of war! Woohoo!
What's Bizzare is that some of the really hard-core Hillary types have been demanding that Obama not pick any other woman.
Sarah Palin is totally out of left Feild, some people were expecting McCain to pick Kay Bailey Hutchison or even Meg Whitman, along with the usual suspects of Pawlenty or Lieberman or Tom Ridge.
I don't know that much about Palin, I do know she got into office after defeating seriously corrupt incumbent (Lisa Merkowski's father, IIRC) in the republican primary. posted by delmoi at 8:12 AM on August 29
Shouldn't we be thinking now more than ever about who is ready to lead this country on day one, not who can get elected?
Don't be silly. I'd take a milf over smarmy Joe Biden any day. posted by jsavimbi at 8:12 AM on August 29
Might as well start:
...and this spring she gave birth to her fifth child, who was found to have Down syndrome.
Uh-huh. 44 years old and four kids aren't enough? Did she not get the memo about the high chance of Down's Syndrome for babies born by older (over 35 I believe) women? I imagine wanting to have as many kids as possible has something to do with her religious beliefs. Probably everything to do with her religious beliefs.
The investigation outlined in that last link sounds like an episode of COPS. Real class act we got here. She is easy on the eyes, though, which can only help her TV presence.
And yes, she really was Miss Congeniality. No, really. posted by zardoz at 8:14 AM on August 29 [3 favorites]
And there's no way she's prepard to take over if McCain dies.
I've heard this from a number of times already, and I don't think the Obama supporters making this claim realize how ridiculous it sounds coming from them. Four years as a Senator is plenty of experience, but two years of governorship? No way she's prepared. posted by Kwantsar at 8:14 AM on August 29 [4 favorites]
I question the wisdom of this choice from a McCain perspective. You'll get some PUMAs, sure, but it severely undercuts the Republicans' main line of attack against Obama: that he's not experienced enough. Has Palin ever been outside of the country? Met a foreign leader?
Also: how long before we see footage of the Miss Alaska pageant juxtaposed with a scary attack-ad narrator reminding Americans that the presidency is "not a beauty pageant"? posted by sy at 8:15 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
Not only does this cinch the election for McCain...
In a near 50/50 split, all the Republicans would need is a small number of Hillary supporters who cared more about what Hillary represented than her policies to switch over. The man is crazy like a fox.
That's what Im thinking. A lot of women who may reluctantly vote Democrat or who dont usually vote will come out in droves to vote for another women, solely on gender. If that gets McCain an extra half percent in 2 or 3 strategic states then he just won. I think this is a genius move.
I feel that Obama just lost or that this race will be decided on a razor thin margin. posted by damn dirty ape at 8:16 AM on August 29
I have that same dread. But maybe (just maybe) Obama can actually get the younger demographic to come out and !(@!& vote on what is probably the most important elected position on this planet. posted by Harry at 8:18 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
experience: She has none. Palin is utterly unqualified to be president of the U.S. Senate, let alone the country should anything befall McCain.
She’s a former beauty pageant winner who’s done multiple cover shoots for fashion and culture magazines
Take a gander at Fox News sometime. Do you think any of those peroxide blondes have ever taken a journalism course?
Joe Republican wants gays to stay in San Francisco, a closet full of guns, and a TV full of war and pretty women. If "experience" or "qualifications' were any sort of requirement Republicans would never win. posted by plexi at 8:18 AM on August 29 [12 favorites]
Four years as a Senator is plenty of experience, but two years of governorship? No way she's prepared.
No, four years as a U.S. Senator plus eight years as a State Senator is more prepared than 18 months of governorship and six years as the mayor of a town smaller than your average community college. Can we be done with this one now? posted by XQUZYPHYR at 8:18 AM on August 29 [66 favorites]
Looks like a pretty naked attempt to go after the Ellen Jamesian Society vote -- voters so blinded with anger and bitterness about the primary loss to Obama, that they'll vote for McCain just out of spite, even against the exhortations of their own messiah -- on McCain's part.
I do not think that this cohort is statistically significant in anyway, so it won't work. It's a blown opportunity for McCain.
I was really hoping for Lieberman, if for no other reason than for an opportunity to see both of these demagogic jackasses run out of the country on a rail come November. posted by psmealey at 8:18 AM on August 29 [4 favorites]
Uh-huh. 44 years old and four kids aren't enough? Did she not get the memo about the high chance of Down's Syndrome for babies born by older (over 35 I believe) women? I imagine wanting to have as many kids as possible has something to do with her religious beliefs. Probably everything to do with her religious beliefs.
Sarah Palin appears to be an inexperienced politician chosen primarily for short-sighted demographic appeal. But (imho, of course) it's completely distasteful to criticize her for wanting to have children, or for having the misfortunate to have a disabled child. Quite frankly, I found her quoted response about her child in the Wikipedia article:
"I'm looking at him right now, and I see perfection," Palin said. "Yeah, he has an extra chromosome. I keep thinking, in our world, what is normal and what is perfect?"
Wow. If there was any doubt that this whole election is about identity politics, that's pretty much gone now.
Problem is - McCain is old. Are Republicans really going to be okay with this woman as President?
He's playing to the undecideds, here, but he risks losing his Republican base.
I heard that he might pick her on NPR this morning. The only clue? Someone had updated the wikipedia article about her and then quickly changed it back.... posted by lunit at 8:20 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
It's gonna take a lot of popcorn and beer and a real comfortable chair to sit and watch the next few months..... posted by HuronBob at 8:22 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
"I'm looking at him right now, and I see perfection," Palin said. "Yeah, he has an extra chromosome. I keep thinking, in our world, what is normal and what is perfect?"
Celebrity: She’s a former beauty pageant winner who’s done multiple cover shoots for fashion and culture magazines and her claim to fame is being the subject of an article titled “America’s Hottest Governor.” There will be more talk about how she’s attractive than her actual policy credentials. Her gender, in light of her utter political weakness, will be seen blatantly- and rightly- as the novelty McCain picked it for. There is no clearer a celebrity pick for McCain than this one.
I also wonder if that's going to seriously backfire with the PUMA types as well, I mean if these older women are upset about all the men that they feel have gotten an easier time in life because of their gender, how are they going to feel about a beautiful woman getting ahead based on her looks, rather then her "hard work". Hillary was never about good looks and glamor.
I mean I don't know at all, but I imagine that some of those women are going to feel that she was picked for her looks, since she really doesn't have much experience. Certainly doesn't compare to Biden or even Obama himself. posted by delmoi at 8:23 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
I've heard this from a number of times already, and I don't think the Obama supporters making this claim realize how ridiculous it sounds coming from them. Four years as a Senator is plenty of experience, but two years of governorship? No way she's prepared.
From wikipedia:
Palin's experience: After being selected as the runner up in the 1984 Miss Alaska contest, Palin served two terms on the Wasilla, Alaska City Council from 1992 to 1996, was elected mayor of Wasilla in 1996, and ran unsuccessfully for Lieutenant Governor in 2002.
After charging ethical violations by state Republican Party leaders,[2] she won election in 2006 by first defeating the incumbent governor in the Republican primary, then a former Democratic Alaskan governor in the general election.
Obama's experience: A graduate of Columbia University and Harvard Law School, where he served as president of the Harvard Law Review, Obama worked as a community organizer and practiced as a civil rights attorney before serving in the Illinois Senate from 1997 to 2004. He taught constitutional law at the University of Chicago Law School from 1992 to 2004. Following an unsuccessful bid for a seat in the U.S. House of Representatives in 2000, he announced his campaign for the U.S. Senate in January 2003. After a primary victory in March 2004, Obama delivered the keynote address at the Democratic National Convention in July 2004. He was elected to the Senate in November 2004 with 70% of the vote.
As a member of the Democratic minority in the 109th Congress, he helped create legislation to control conventional weapons and to promote greater public accountability in the use of federal funds. He also made official trips to Eastern Europe, the Middle East, and Africa. During the 110th Congress, he helped create legislation regarding lobbying and electoral fraud, climate change, nuclear terrorism, and care for returned U.S. military personnel. After announcing his presidential campaign in February 2007, Obama emphasized withdrawing American troops from Iraq, energy independence, decreasing the influence of lobbyists, and promoting universal health care as top national priorities.
She's a spokesmodel for the conservative right. It's a smart, if revolting, pick. posted by argybarg at 8:25 AM on August 29 [2 favorites]
I don't like Sarah Palin. I admit it's something of a pet issue of mine, but her wildlife management practices in Alaska are horrible. After Alaskan voters voted against aerial hunting of wolves, she went against the will of the people by adding a bounty for wolf kills.
I'm sick to death of this entire "presidential race" and I wish they could just get things over with and let the Republicans steal the election now so we can all go back to our lives already. posted by infinitywaltz at 8:25 AM on August 29 [3 favorites]
How tough will Joe Biden be able to get on her in the debate without people calling him a sexist pig? (Notwithstanding his voting record and the whole violence against women legislation thing or anything that actually makes sense) posted by wabbittwax at 8:25 AM on August 29
Who sounds more qualified to be President?
posted by Fuzzy Monster
I also wonder if that's going to seriously backfire with the PUMA types as well, I mean if these older women are upset about all the men that they feel have gotten an easier time in life because of their gender, how are they going to feel about a beautiful woman getting ahead based on her looks, rather then her "hard work".
> In a near 50/50 split, all the Republicans would need is a bunch of crooked voting machines.
You're living in the past, Fuzzy Monster. It's just like that rainforest scare a few years back. Our officials saw there was a problem and they fixed it, didn't they? posted by The Card Cheat at 8:27 AM on August 29
"I still can’t answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the V.P. does every day?"
-- Sarah Palin, on being the possible vice presidential nominee posted by Rhaomi at 8:28 AM on August 29 [13 favorites]
Bumbling, old senator as President, and the hot, young moose-burger-eating Governor from Alaska as VP?
I can't wait for the VP debates. "Governor Palin, Recent polls have shown a fifth of Americans can't locate the U.S. on a world map. Why do you think this is?" posted by hydrophonic at 8:28 AM on August 29 [31 favorites]
Remember when GHWB picked Dan Quale as his Vice Presidential running mate? People have been saying ever since that it was a misstep. This is an even bigger misstep and John McCain doesn't have the horsepower and momentum to overcome such an obviously poor choice. Experience and judgement indeed. posted by Daddy-O at 8:29 AM on August 29 [2 favorites]
Rhaomi: ""I still can’t answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the V.P. does every day?"
-- Sarah Palin, on being the possible vice presidential nominee"
I've had this nagging fear all along that McCain was going to win no matter what Obama did. Now I know he is. This is indeed a brilliant PR move and yes, this election is historic no matter what.
*sigh* The first woman VP is pretty awesome. I just wish it could be from a campaign that wasn't going to flush America further down the toilet. posted by grapefruitmoon at 8:29 AM on August 29
But (imho, of course) it's completely distasteful to criticize her for wanting to have children, or for having the misfortunate to have a disabled child.
I am criticizing her for wanting to have children, but what does that have to do with having a disabled child? Please don't conflate these two things. I think it is a fair criticism to question a woman who is 44 years of age, and therefore more likely to have a disabled child. Her decision to have a child in the first place put the child at risk before he/she was even born. I dunno, maybe I'm cranky at the motives of religious types these days, but just because someone wants to be a mother doesn't automatically make it a good idea. posted by zardoz at 8:31 AM on August 29 [23 favorites]
Shouldn't we be thinking now more than ever about who is ready to lead this country on day one, not who can get elected? It all just looks like such a nakedly political move to me in a way that Biden's selection really didn't come off as.
What are you talking about? The McCain camp has critized Obama as being too young and inexperienced in foreign policy, and not ready to lead, so Obama chose someone who can offset those charges -- someone who is old and experienced and has lots of foreign policy experience. Of course it was a political move to pick him. Pick the person who can most help you win the election. I mean, duh.
Obama's camp has critized McCain for being old and stuffy and too much like George Bush, and one of McCain's biggest weaknesses is in not being seen as someone who will bring about change, someone who cares about little people, someone who will bring in the breath of fresh air that Obama is seen as. Palin could not be further from George Bush and Washington. She has the same youth that Obama has and McCain lacks. She is a big reformer in Alaska, and is supposedly the most popular Governor in the US. The fact that she may appeal to the ex-Hillary voters is frankly a brilliantly political move. And it reinforces his reputation as a maverick, something the Democrats have been trying to erase during the convention.
I don't usually mind it, and I guess I don't mind it so much in this thread, either, but it is clear to me that Metafilter is so partisan that it can't really view election issues clearly or with any distance. This was a really smart move for McCain, as long as she doesn't have something in her past that will come back to bite him. This next week and the Republican convention might be tough for Democrats. posted by onlyconnect at 8:31 AM on August 29 [7 favorites]
I'll work my fingers to the bone for Obama, but this is depressing. Palin is good shtick -- imagine the convention address, the mooseburger recipes, etc. She'll be a horrible VP, but she's politically good pick. posted by argybarg at 8:32 AM on August 29
pardonyou?writes"'I'm looking at him right now, and I see perfection,' Palin said. 'Yeah, he has an extra chromosome. I keep thinking, in our world, what is normal and what is perfect?'"
Lots of Rupublican compassion for an extra chromosome, not so much for men born liking show-tunes and cock. posted by orthogonality at 8:32 AM on August 29 [19 favorites]
My $1.99 opinion: It's a desperation move. Someone who can make the ticket look younger and whom they hope will pull just enough PUMA votes away from the Obama-Biden ticket. I also think they are hoping her looks and personality will take some of the attention off McCain. Clearly, they are tightly managing his interviews and appearances...and for good reason! posted by jleisek at 8:32 AM on August 29
Her previous office was the mayor of an Alaskan town with a population smaller than 3,000 people.
The GOP is sick of your lies. The town has 8,000 people now! posted by Ironmouth at 8:32 AM on August 29
Joke acknowledged, but she's not as conservative on that issue as you might think (which may actually end up causing a problem with ultra-conservatives):
brilliant pick; even more brilliant given the fact that many, many Hillary voters saw Hillary as a step in the direction of women's rights. These voters aren't policy voters; they're visceral voters. That's why people still don't understand why Kerry lost in 2004. Voters are more visceral than most think; instead of fighting that ( like dems do), repulicans embrace it, and win. Our voting populace may be stupid, and we may elect corrupt bastards, but Dems have been so inept at understanding voter thinking that they think they'll win on the issues. McCain has such a great shot now. posted by SeizeTheDay at 8:36 AM on August 29 [8 favorites]
The smartest thing that McCain has done so far. Kudos to him for not selecting the "obvious" choices (Pawlenty, Ridge, etc). Palin brings energy, "youth," interesting background, and personality to the campaign. posted by davidmsc at 8:38 AM on August 29
Palin faces probe.
That just sounds naisty! posted by ColdChef at 8:38 AM on August 29
>Lots of Rupublican compassion for an extra chromosome, not so much for men born liking show-tunes and cock.
What? Where is this gay gene? Science explains homosexuality as being sourced for a slew of issues and we have seen that twins with identical DNA do not fall into the same sex preference. Its highly highly disingenuous to compare down's syndrome to homosexuality. That doesnt make homosexuality a choice, but we cant keep spreading the convenient lie that its no different than downs or hemophilia for bullshit political points. It makes your side look bad. Real bad. posted by damn dirty ape at 8:38 AM on August 29 [3 favorites]
This is a desperation pick folks.
Well, to be fair, Palin is former a former member of the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission. So I guess her energy platform will be using flop sweat as a renewable resource.
Good god I am peeing myself waiting for the debate with Biden now. posted by XQUZYPHYR at 8:38 AM on August 29 [4 favorites]
This is a new era in American history. No matter who wins, a long-standing barrier will be broken. At long last, a non-contiguous state will be represented in the White House!
If only Eisenhower was still here to see the realization of his beautiful dream. *sniff* posted by designbot at 8:39 AM on August 29 [16 favorites]
Larry Kudlow of CNBC’s “Kudlow & Co.” asked her about the possibility of becoming McCain's ticket mate.
Palin replied: “As for that VP talk all the time, I’ll tell you, I still can’t answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the VP does every day? I’m used to being very productive and working real hard in an administration. We want to make sure that that VP slot would be a fruitful type of position, especially for Alaskans and for the things that we’re trying to accomplish up here for the rest of the U.S., before I can even start addressing that question.”
I've been carrying on a conversation with my sister all morning about who we wanter to see as McCain's VP. (we're both liberal Democrats.) My best-case scenario for Dems was Palin:
1. The Repubs just lost the "Obama hasn't got the experience" issue,
2. I can't wait to see her head to head against Biden in the debates.
3. I've always thought the PUMA issue was BS. Now McCain looks like he's pandering. posted by Mcable at 8:40 AM on August 29
I guess McCain gets to put his "Maverick" hat back on. posted by ColdChef at 8:41 AM on August 29
Hey! Here's a female politician it's okay to hate! And she's pretty! Let's break out the sexism! posted by lunit at 8:43 AM on August 29 [22 favorites]
It really doesn't matter who John McCain picks.
John McCain could choose a former beauty queen from Alaska as a running mate and he'd still win this election.
Weird, just weird. So far, this is the most confusing moment in this election cycle.
The effects of this are unpredictable.
It's like Obama upped the ante on the turn last night, forcing McCain, down on chips and with a mediocre hand, to decide whether to give up a substantial pot or gamble and go all in. This is McCain going all in. posted by C.Batt at 8:44 AM on August 29 [9 favorites]
This was a really smart move for McCain
I can't disagree with this more. She is a political lightweight, is in no way qualified to be president, and this decision will completely torpedo John McCain's claim to good judgement and the value of experience. If she makes the mistake of attempting to take Biden on in a debate, she will be utterly humiliated. Think John Connally eviscerated Dan Quayle? Just you wait. posted by Daddy-O at 8:44 AM on August 29 [3 favorites]
On preview: XQUZYPHYR nailed it. posted by Mcable at 8:44 AM on August 29
Think John Connally eviscerated Dan Quayle? Just you wait.
I'd love to hear Biden say this: "I knew Dan Quayle. I served in the senate with Dan Quayle. You are no Dan Quayle." posted by Mcable at 8:46 AM on August 29 [36 favorites]
when did Alaska become a state? I thought it was still a territory. posted by Postroad at 8:47 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
No, this is not good for Biden in the debates.
Mitt Romney or Tim Pawlenty, Biden could have wiped the floor with, no holds barred. But where are people's sympathies going to lie when they see an angry old man yelling at the nice, pretty hockey mom who only had a few weeks to get ready before being thrust into the national spotlight? posted by designbot at 8:47 AM on August 29 [3 favorites]
I guess Susan Collins, Christie Todd Whitman, Oympia Snowe, and Elizabeth Dole were busy. posted by kirkaracha at 8:48 AM on August 29 [23 favorites]
"I still can’t answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the V.P. does every day?"
Well, to be fair no one really knows what the V.P does every day, it's kind of a job you get to define in your own terms with the President. On the one hand you have Cheney, on the other you have Quayle. Some are powerful, some are not. posted by delmoi at 8:48 AM on August 29
Or...
"I know Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton is a friend of mine...." posted by R. Mutt at 8:48 AM on August 29 [7 favorites]
Hillary voters saw Hillary as a step in the direction of women's rights. These voters aren't policy voters; they're visceral voters. That's why people still don't understand why Kerry lost in 2004. Voters are more visceral than most think; instead of fighting that ( like dems do), repulicans embrace it, and win.
Hillary voters didn't just vote for a woman, they voted for Hillary Clinton. There's a big difference. Many of them have been following her political career for over a decade, and won't be likely to jump ship to some other woman in politics. If she campaigns strongly against Palin, she has a very good chance of defusing this momentum.
And as far as visceral, GWB won in 2004 off of the Evangelical vote. Many of those same people voted for Huckabee in the primaries this year rather than McCain. And many of those same people probably don't like the idea of having a woman president. I think this pick will lose more voters for McCain than it gains. posted by burnmp3s at 8:48 AM on August 29 [4 favorites]
It's gonna take a lot of popcorn and beer and a real comfortable chair to sit and watch the next few months.....
indeed!
LOL posted by a3matrix at 8:49 AM on August 29
pardonyou?writes"on preview: same point to orthogonality"
Point taken, thanks for the correction.
But note I said "Republican compassion", not "Palin's compassion". Now, since she's pro-life but doesn't hate the gays, so it'll be interesting to see how the Fundies (who don't much like McCain) react to his choice. If he's gained Hillary dead-endrs with Palin but further eroded th Republican base's support, is this a net gain?
I mean, the Fundie base will man your phonebanks and vote. I can't see most of the Hillary dead-enders (other than the public faces of PUMA, who are probably mainly Republican operatives anyway) manning, er, womanning the phone banks. They might vote McCain to spite Obama, but they aren't going to make phone calls for an anti-choice candidate. posted by orthogonality at 8:49 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
I can't fathom anyone actually buying into this crap. What a joke. posted by fusinski at 8:50 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
What a weird choice. An unknown, inexperienced woman from the back of beyond, tainted with the whiff of scandal.
The Republicans either don't want to be elected (can't blame them; the mess that needs to be cleaned up is horrifying) or are so cock-sure about cheating themselves into rule that they can mock the electorate. posted by five fresh fish at 8:52 AM on August 29 [2 favorites]
She is a political lightweight...
One wonders how fast she'll be on her feet in front of the national press. Can she take a curveball with both feet out of her mouth? posted by DU at 8:52 AM on August 29
Meg Whitman, Carly Fiorina, and Condoleeza Rice were busy, too. posted by kirkaracha at 8:54 AM on August 29 [3 favorites]
Good god I am peeing myself waiting for the debate with Biden now.
I was thinking the exact same thing. His experience and ability to quickly cut deep with his words? It's going to be like watching a fight between an attack dog and a balloon. posted by quin at 8:54 AM on August 29 [19 favorites]
If Hilary campaigns against Palin, going on record as to why Palin is no substitute for herself and that one is better to vote Obama, I doubt there's going to be much crossover voting. posted by five fresh fish at 8:56 AM on August 29 [2 favorites]
But where are people's sympathies going to lie when they see an angry old man yelling at the nice, pretty hockey mom who only had a few weeks to get ready before being thrust into the national spotlight?
There is no way he'll yell. He won't intimidate and he won't push hard. Quiet gravitas and appeals to experience, the very themes McCain has been hammering home as essential to this election, will be enough to wilt this pick.
Seriously, you have to wonder what these people are thinking. They push the celebrity line and then McCain undercuts it with his seven homes stumble. They push the experience line and McCain undercuts it by picking a running mate with next to no experience. The underlying anxiety about his candidacy is his age and his fading faculties, a concern which is only exacerbated by this choice. Obama is making decisive moves. He's building an organization and addressing his weaknesses on the national stage. Against that, McCain's campaign begins to look very small.
Why is everyone assuming she'll do so poorly in the debates? Because she's a pretty woman? posted by Perplexity at 8:58 AM on August 29 [7 favorites]
lunit: Wow. If there was any doubt that this whole election is about identity politics, that's pretty much gone now.
In spite of the disagreeable fractiousness of identity politics, which feels like the play-at-home version of corporate special interests, I sense something else in picks like this - a refined political theater that decouples the identity from the politics. That they can win public approval by fulfilling the pattern of "first woman X" without substantively bending to any associated policy is now obvious to them - I submit the Bush administration's very own Black female Secretary of State. Others have already pointed out Palin's stance on abortion.
It's worse than voting for someone who looks like me because I expect preferential representation. It's voting for someone who looks like me for the sympathetic magic, for the drama, for the vicarious hell of it. posted by kid ichorous at 8:59 AM on August 29 [6 favorites]
Yes, and if I'm remembering right, so have all the first ladies. Palin's husband is Yupik. posted by merelyglib at 8:59 AM on August 29
As long as Biden can maintain the "hate the sin, not the sinner" approach that was (imho) well established during the convention, he ought to be able to attack her as firmly on the issues as he would've Romney or Pawlenty. posted by feloniousmonk at 9:00 AM on August 29
Why is everyone assuming she'll do so poorly in the debates? Because she's a pretty woman?
Why do you assume that's the only basis on which to doubt her performance in the debates? posted by felix betachat at 9:00 AM on August 29 [26 favorites]
Here's a female politician it's okay to hate! And she's pretty! Let's break out the sexism!
Suggesting that someone is sexist because they don't like the Anti-Choice, creationist person who counts a beauty contest as election experience is like saying that because you don't care for Obama's healthcare plan, you are a racist. posted by ColdChef at 9:00 AM on August 29 [58 favorites]
I just took two minutes out of my day to read up on her bio: this person has never had a job. Either this is a joke, or the GOP brass are the only ones in the know that the occupants of the White House are merely trade representatives of USA, Inc., and when it comes to peddling crap, it's better to offer something better to look at than your competition. posted by jsavimbi at 9:01 AM on August 29
"Senator McCain, where is your VP candidate from?"
"Alaska"
"No, I'm asking YOU the question, Senator."
"Juneau."
"No, I DON'T know—that's why I'm asking!"
"Anchorage."
"Do you really need encouragement just to answer the question?" posted by ericbop at 9:01 AM on August 29 [9 favorites]
All the first ladies have been white males?! Well, that explains Eleanor Roosevelt. posted by ColdChef at 9:02 AM on August 29 [3 favorites]
Quite frankly, I found her quoted response about her child in the Wikipedia article:
"I'm looking at him right now, and I see perfection," Palin said. "Yeah, he has an extra chromosome. I keep thinking, in our world, what is normal and what is perfect?"
To be quite inspiring.
Apart from the amazing and apparently unself-conscious irony of this statement in the mouth of a beauty pageant contestant, I'd be more inclined to agree if it weren't for the fact that all people with Down syndrome develop Alzheimer disease in ther forties or early fifties. posted by jamjam at 9:02 AM on August 29 [2 favorites]
Sufficed to say, Palin will not be getting The Sierra Club's endorsement. posted by XQUZYPHYR at 9:02 AM on August 29
This is a really poor choice, IMO. Disgruntled PUMA's were going to vote for McCain anyway, and voters who wanted Clinton because of her history of "being a fighter" and a champion of women's rights are not going to be pleased with obvious pandering. Anyone who has the least concern about electing a 72 year old President is not going to be comforted by the thought of a former Alaskan governor with hardly any experience running the country. I think the campaign shot itself in the foot. posted by oneirodynia at 9:02 AM on August 29 [2 favorites]
"Senator McCain, where is your VP candidate from?"
"Alaska"
"No, I'm asking YOU the question, Senator."
"Juneau."
"No, I DON'T know—that's why I'm asking!"
"Anchorage."
"Do you really need encouragement just to answer the question?"
Are you kidding me? The possible "scandal" is that she might — might — have abused her authority to try to get a cop who drove drunk on the job and tasered his 11-year-old kid fired. I'm sure people are going to be really fucking up in arms over that one. Come the fuck on. If it comes out during the campaign that she did do it, watch her positives jump as the campaign frames her as being hounded by meddling Democratic investigators for taking a bad cop off the street and if she had to bend a few rules to do it, well, that's just how effing mavericky she is ain't it?
Think John Connally eviscerated Dan Quayle? Just you wait.
You mean former vice president Dan Quayle? The guy who won?
I wouldn't be surprised if someone in the Obama campaign suggested preparing an ad with the video of Palin saying she needs someone to tell her what the VP does and the suggestion was shot down because no way would McCain make such a poor choice.
The Hillary supporters are going to be insulted that McCain made such a bad choice just to pander to women. I'm glad that Obama didn't pick Hillary as his VP, but it would have been killer diller to watch Hillary smash Palin in such a one sided debate. posted by Daddy-O at 9:03 AM on August 29
Why is everyone assuming she'll do so poorly in the debates? Because she's a pretty woman?
Yes, it's entirely a sexist thing, and has nothing to do with her lack of experience. Now quick, use the widest brush you have to tar "the left" for being sexist.
I heard that there are so few women in Alaska that a "ten" is a four that brings a six-pack. posted by Bitter soylent at 9:04 AM on August 29 [16 favorites]
I can't believe how many apparent Lefties on this site are so eager to trip over themselves in anguish over this "brilliant" move, like McCain has somehow locked up the election or something with this move.
As XQUZYPHYR said, "Really?"
Looks like a desperation move to me. What's she bringing to the table other than "woman"? And how is this pick going to bring the Evangelical Right, who already dislike McCain, back into the fold?
Folks, this election is not even going to be close. Mark my words. posted by mkultra at 9:06 AM on August 29 [6 favorites]
What are the other reasons? Why would lack of experience correlate with being bad at debating? posted by Perplexity at 9:06 AM on August 29
[I]t is clear to me that Metafilter is so partisan that it can't really view election issues clearly or with any distance. This was a really smart move for McCain, as long as she doesn't have something in her past that will come back to bite him. This next week and the Republican convention might be tough for Democrats.
Palin was named on Veep lists (and future Pres. lists) a year or two ago, but not recently at all. From a purely pragmatic and political standpoint, the female Veep possibilities were "supposed" to be either Meg Whitman or Kay Bailey Hutchinson. The conventional wisdom has been that Palin was off the table because of her ongoing ethics scandal, it would grossly highlight's McCain's age, fallout from McCain's own hammering Obama on the experience/"ready to lead" issue would land on her as well, she adds little following, name-recognition, or clout to the ticket other than being fairly unobjectionable to the Republican base, and Palin herself has not made any deliberate play for or even demonstrated any interest in the position given that she's been busy taking care of her newborn. In short, she was eliminated from virtually all political insiders' first-tier picks for many, many reasons when she was looked at under cold, objective light a number of months ago. "Smart" is definitely overstating the case for choosing Palin, but "desperate" is being too uncharitable. Let's call a spade a spade: Palin as the VP pick would be extremely risky. I think a pick like this would say more about the McCain camp's own view of their current position, the other VP possibilities, and the expected trajectory of the rest of the campaign than anything else.
It's not the team sitting on a safe lead that calls for a Hail Mary -- but then again, the play's been known to win many a game. It's not exactly a smart play, but not quite as desperate as an onside kick or faked punt, either. It's a risky, usually unsuccessful maneuver that occasionally reaps massive dividends. Palin means McCain is a gambling man. posted by DaShiv at 9:06 AM on August 29 [61 favorites]
An awful lot of you seem to be assuming that women voters are shallow idiots, and that PUMAs are more than an invention of Fox News. posted by QIbHom at 9:07 AM on August 29 [30 favorites]
But (imho, of course) it's completely distasteful to criticize her for wanting to have children, or for having the misfortunate to have a disabled child.
I think the really pertinent thing here is that her fifth child was born in April 2008, and she returned to work just three days after giving birth.
Obama has been a strong critic of the fact that the US is basically the only "first world" nation that fails to provide paid leave for new mothers. I have to wonder what Palin's view on parental leave is, given the example she's set that basically says to mothers "hey, its not that hard. Just go back to work. You can do it if you try hard enough." posted by anastasiav at 9:07 AM on August 29 [7 favorites]
A seemingly brilliant move, but in reality, a 100% cynical choice. posted by interrobang at 9:07 AM on August 29
Well, if nothing else this clarifies the contours of the crossroads America's arrived at. So which path will it be, America? Which version of yourself will you embrace in this dark hour? Are you the keepers of the bright and perpetual flame of enlightenment values and constitutional democracy, or are you a reality TV show cast handing out free junk food? posted by gompa at 9:07 AM on August 29 [8 favorites]
zardoz: Her decision to have a child in the first place
It is quite likely that she did not decide to have a child, but that she became pregnant. It happens. Whatever the case, it is non of our business. Did you remark on the number of McCains children, and the fact that it is risky to have a child at a later age as a father (he was 55) in the threads about his nomination?
I found your Did she not get the memo about the high chance of Down's Syndrome for babies born by older (over 35 I believe) women? incredibly offensive. What exactly do you mean? Women who are older than 35 should not have children? Children with Down's syndrome should not exist? Women who get a child with Down syndrome are somehow stupid? posted by davar at 9:07 AM on August 29 [29 favorites]
It's like Obama upped the ante on the turn last night, forcing McCain, down on chips and with a mediocre hand ...
What on earth are you talking about, "down on chips"?
For all I know, the media are yapping about how McCain closed the gap in the polls despite the Democratic convention and might be even leading now (although personally, I don't trust the polls and think they are one half skewed and the other half made up on the fly). He's poised to win.
quin on Biden: His experience and ability to quickly cut deep with his words? It's going to be like watching a fight between an attack dog and a balloon.
And this is why Biden will lose the debates. Nobody likes the attack dog who picked on the pretty girl. It's a situation where Biden cannot possibly score any points. Not that it matters much, since noone would choose Obama just because his VP candidate did good on the debates anyway. The situation is different for McCain, though, since there are enough idiots in the US that will make their choice solely based on gender, race or sexual history of the candidate, completely irregardless of their policy. The Republicans have figured this out better than the Dems. posted by sour cream at 9:08 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
Why is everyone assuming she'll do so poorly in the debates? Because she's a pretty woman?
No, it's because she doesn't have much experience and doesn't seem to know what the VP even does. That's 10th grade Government class basics, and she wants to BE the VP? Holy cow, McCain is DONE. posted by Daddy-O at 9:09 AM on August 29
I also think the pick reflects McCain's intense displeasure at being upstaged by anyone, particularly his VP choice.
And how is this pick going to bring the Evangelical Right, who already dislike McCain, back into the fold?
Sarah Palin thinks creationism should be taught alongside evolution in schools. She's anti-choice. This is definitely a fundie pander as well. posted by oneirodynia at 9:09 AM on August 29 [3 favorites]
I was going to write something, but XQUZYPHYR, wrote it for me. posted by rmmcclay at 9:09 AM on August 29 [2 favorites]
More and more, I think the Republican party is deliberately throwing this election. They don't want to do the dirty work of cleaning up after Bush. It's going to be a difficult, costly, unpopular job, and I bet they're counting on the pain it causes to be such that it destroys the Democrats chances for re-election. They're giving up four years in return for twenty.
The same seems to be happening in Canada. The Reeeeeform party is out for blood, the intention being to wholly destroy our centrist Liberal party, turning this into a two-party state of extreme right and extreme left views. posted by five fresh fish at 9:10 AM on August 29 [17 favorites]
Why is everyone assuming she'll do so poorly in the debates? Because she's a pretty woman?
Remy beat me to it, but it has nothing to do with the fact that she's a woman and everything to do with Biden having 35 years of experience as an elected official versus her eighteen or so months. Also, Biden has proven repeatedly that he can verbally eviscerate his opposition even when they have years of practice, so unless she has some kind of hidden debate-jujitsu, I'm betting she doesn't fare well against him. posted by quin at 9:13 AM on August 29 [5 favorites]
Sour cream: "..completely irregardless of their policy."
this feels a little bit like george mc govern's search for a vice presidential candidate in 1968: ted kennedy declined, sargent shriver was out of reach, walter mondale also said no, abe ribicoff had better things to do, kevin white was vetoed, walter cronkite wasn't asked until it was too late, gaylord nelson refused and by this time around it was down to the guy running the ice cream truck down the street and some obscure senater named tom eagleton nobody seemed to know all that well. we all know how that story turned out: words like landslide and electro-shock-therapy have been used more often than I care to recount.
so, dearest barack: you may have a funny name, you may be black, you may be against abortion, you may have a real problem with the hillary crowd but the republicans seem to have acquired a taste for that old dance the democrats have very nearly perfected since the days of good old hapless george mc govern. you may be hopeful.
Think John Connally eviscerated Dan Quayle? Just you wait.
You mean former vice president Dan Quayle? The guy who won?
George H W Bush won in spite of picking Quayle as VP. Remember? posted by Daddy-O at 9:15 AM on August 29
"brilliant pick; even more brilliant given the fact that many, many Hillary voters saw Hillary as a step in the direction of women's rights. These voters aren't policy voters; they're visceral voters." SeizeTheDay
Agreed. But I don't know why everyone's so quick to hate on or even be surprised by the "visceral" women; look at Obama's 90+ to 1 margin among black voters. Is the tribal nature of our politics so surprising to us that we can't move past it? posted by resurrexit at 9:16 AM on August 29
damn... for abortion. I don't even get their pseudo-arguments listed right.
I need more sleep. posted by krautland at 9:16 AM on August 29
For all I know, the media are yapping about how McCain closed the gap in the polls despite the Democratic convention and might be even leading now (although personally, I don't trust the polls and think they are one half skewed and the other half made up on the fly). He's poised to win.
I don't understand this- McCain's not leading the polls at the moment; convention bounce (if any) won't really be seen until Monday. 78% of women don't know who the heck Sarah Palin is. There hasn't been a single debate, and yet you can confidently state three months before the election that McCain is poised to win? posted by oneirodynia at 9:17 AM on August 29 [2 favorites]
Suggesting that someone is sexist because they don't like the Anti-Choice, creationist person who counts a beauty contest as election experience...
Ah, but that's not what I suggested. I was referring to how quickly the thread filled with sex jokes. This knee-jerk defensiveness thing is old. posted by lunit at 9:17 AM on August 29 [1 favorite]
George H W Bush won in spite of picking Quayle as VP. Remember?
"Senator McCain, where is your VP candidate from?"
"Alaska"
"No, I'm asking YOU the question, Senator."
"Juneau."
"No, I DON'T know—that's why I'm asking!"
"Anchorage."
"Do you really need encouragement just to answer the question?"
Nome?
No sir, we do not. That's why we're asking you.
"Fairbanks."
"Senator McCain, there will be time to discuss your financial policies later. I'm asking about your VP selection." posted by pardonyou? at 9:19 AM on August 29 [5 favorites]
Think John Connally eviscerated Dan Quayle?
No, I think Lloyd Bentsen did it. And still lost by 7 million votes and an 80/20 split of the electoral college. She's a lightweight, yes, but bad VP choices don't lose you an election. Perot grabbed nearly 20 million votes in spite of Stockdale's embarrassing performance.
Her abysmal qualifications only means the bar will be set so incredibly low that not killing herself tripping over it will be seen as a monumental achievement. OK, so McCain has put Eddie Gaedel up to bat for him. The Dems can't strike her out. And if she does happen to even touch the ball, it's a veritable home run. posted by GhostintheMachine at 9:19 AM on August 29
Am I the only one thinking he is going for Laura Roslin and the BSG vote? posted by
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posted by ColdChef at 7:57 AM on August 29 [9 favorites]